Best argument I've ever seen for the Oxford Comma

paxanimus · 1 day

Agreed, there are more ways to use the comma than not, or to simply write the sentence differently.

paxanimus · 1 day

Let's say it's the acknowledgements in your latest book. You'd probably name your dad. At least, I would. And I know you wouldn't write "my dad and Mike and god." But "my dad, Mike, and god" can be read either as three entities or as your dad's name being Mike.

The "and" provides the equivalent tempo for your reader.

paxanimus · 1 day

You'd rather use parentheses than drop the OC? And "My dad, who is Elton John, and God" is a change for the worse.

Elton John is used here for humor. If your dad was Mike Smith, you wouldn't feel like you were name-dropping. You'd probably just write, "My dad, Mike Smith, and God." That can and will be read two ways.

The commas in this list are intended to indicate separate items. You could also write, "My dad and Mike Smith and God" and retain clarity. But it's a lot of ands, so we use commas and then drop the last one if it's unnecessary. It can still be recognized readily as a list.

paxanimus · 1 day

Is your dad Elton John? I can't be sure.

paxanimus · 1 day

Zegota provided an example above: "I'd like to thank my dad, Elton John, and God." Drop the OC: "I'd like to thank my dad, Elton John and God." Is that not better off?

There's value in the OC being optional.

paxanimus · 1 day

I don't argue that the OC shouldn't be used most of the time. As you say, there is no shortage of examples where its absence causes confusion. But insisting upon consistent use goes farther than necessary to address the problem.

I have two jobs, and each involves adherence to a style guide that insists upon one side of the debate. So I work in both extremes, and it has lead me to better understand the value of an inconsistent approach to the OC.

paxanimus · 1 day

Regardless of ability, it is true that insisting upon consistent use of the Oxford Comma does in fact remove the option of leaving it out. I did not mean to imply that the limitation would be crippling. It is a limitation nonetheless.

paxanimus · 1 day

I would say it's lazy to decide to apply it in every situation when there are clear examples where it lends no additional clarity. Perhaps you do not want to take the time to consider those situations. If that's so, then your rule of consistency will have you covered, which I suppose is a decent argument for instructing writers to employ it at all times.

paxanimus · 1 day

It should be considered situational because it's not always necessary. Punctuation is there to guide the reader and ensure comprehension. Many lists simply do not require the Oxford Comma to provide unambiguous meaning. A writer shouldn't add more punctuation than strictly necessary unless he or she wants to control pace or emphasis in a particular way. By insisting upon consistent use of an inconsistently necessary comma, you limit a writer's options.

paxanimus · 2 days

Consistency isn't paramount. The Oxford Comma is situational, as others have already pointed out.

bendvis · 2 days

Your username is fitting!

bendvis · 2 days

I tried a shower mirror for a little while, but it kept falling. I just "see" with my hand, now. A quick pass over the face will tell me if I've missed any spots.

bendvis · 2 days

I shave blind in the shower. It's super easy after some practice. Also, no shaving cream, just a little soap.

Avi_ · 3 days

You can freeze it. Just slice up, dunk it in some lemon water to prevent browning, then onto a plate/pan in the freezer for a few hours. Then you can toss the pieces into a big ziploc bag and they won't stick to each other. Great for smoothies frozen and guacamole if thawed in the microwave.

leoedin · 4 days

Good to know!

segasean · 4 days

Eh, no worries. How could you know? But anyway, my thought about motivation was pure conjecture, as is your mention of suicide or depression. In that hypothetical, one would assume she knew her brother well enough to not worry about drastic consequences.

I don't object to you suggesting she was being a real piece of work by writing the song. I'm just saying that your interpretation is part of the risk of honesty in songwriting.

segasean · 4 days

Pardon me, but I upvoted you. I never downvote someone I'm in discussion with. But I can't control others' actions.

leoedin · 4 days

Gotcha, thanks. That explains why my work's graphic designers recommended we use Arial in Word documents, since our brand's main font is Helvetica.

archduke_of_awesome · 4 days

I started with a Kijiji ad (it's like Craigslist). That brought in a trickle of work, and then I connected with a small, local publisher through a friend. That made it steady. So, networking triumphs again.

segasean · 4 days

And Alfie may well have been livid. That'd be some of that potential harm in her writing that song. Siblings can be tough on each other. And who knows, maybe she was trying to motivate him to change.

DrToonz · 4 days

Cars. On the freeway, we see at least one van with a mattress on top. Who is using the mattresses?

segasean · 4 days

I've always thought that good songwriting (or writing in general, really) relies on honesty. You have to be willing to put real stories, thoughts, or emotions into words, and to accept the potential harm they may inflict.

archduke_of_awesome · 4 days

Ah, that does make it more difficult. Have you tried making a list of the skills you employ in your main line work, and then brainstorming non-competing applications for each? You might come up with some worthy options to explore.

leoedin · 4 days

Arial is bad? (Not a designer)

archduke_of_awesome · 4 days

I'm a writer (corporate marketing/communications), and I do freelance editing on the side. It adds roughly 10% to my annual income. Applying your professional skill-set to freelance works well because you have built-in experience and expertise.

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