What do you think the best build for a Demon Hunter, and what build are you guys using?

TigerRat1 · 6 days

I'm at level 50ish and I use this: http://us.battle.net/d3/en/calculator/demon-hunter#WcdQTl!bYe!abbaZZ

The idea is that rapid fire does crazy single target dps but is super expensive so 2 skills take up no hatred (one generates 3 hatred per second) and multishot (which is awesome for groups of mobs) has the rune that cuts the cost in half. I switch in marked for death against bosses with the rune that makes it so you gain hatred when attacking your target. That + rapid fire = crazy sustained dps.

dignitas_Sui · 19 days

He beat me twice on stream in 1v1 obs with roach rushes :(

ClassicThunder · 22 days

I can't believe that they think this is acceptable. Sure it's kinda sorta balanced but in a TERRIBLE way. Imagine this; you have a forth race that only can makes cannons. Give them like really badass canons that are strong in the early game. They are have a 50% chance of winning if they canon rush even if their opponent knows that cannon rushes are likely but late game they just lose. Is it balanced? Yeah if the forth race all ins every game but it's shit design. That's where terran is right now, they all in or they are at a huge disadvantage.

ClassicThunder · 22 days

There are a lot of things wrong with this statement. First off, teir one units don't just lose their importance. It's not like this is civilization where you have riflemen shooting cavemen. By the 10 minute mark, the highest teir of units are available anyway for terran and protoss (don't forget that medivacs are teir 3 btw).

After bio that leaves mech and air. Mech has been proven time and time again to just suck against toss. Immortals and zealots ruin every unit that comes out of a factory. Similarly with starports, stalkers ruin everything that comes out of a starport. And it's not like you can transition into these units late game either. With toss, if you have colo and switch into zealot immortal, they share all the same upgrades. With terran, you go from a upgraded bio army to 0/0 mech or air against a toss army that gets upgrades faster than you to begin with.

MajorLeeScrewed · 1 month

Despite what Artosis says, mech just isn't as good as marine tank in tvt. The problem with mech is that if you lose air control you lose to 1 cloaked banshee. Then, even if you have a thor to kill banshees, the marine tank player will suicide drop a bunch of marines or marauders on top of your tank line because the thor won't kill it in time.

If you were to compare hellion drops and marine drops, both kill scvs pretty quick but marines also kill buildings fast.

Also in straight up bum rush situations, marines are better than hellions if you micro correctly.

retimanSC · 2 months

Even easier: Morph the archon, pick up both tanks at the same time and just A-move. Pick up the tanks again when they fall.

Frosstyy · 2 months

Fuck these guys, congrats man.

xcrouton · 3 months

Bottom line, don't go into the late game. It's rare even for a pro to win in the late game. Open with the polt 2 rax and keep swinging all game. If you do go into the late game, the only strat I've seen work well is the mass ghost style. Watch Happy vs Creator (I think). Happy made 20+ ghosts, killed observers with vikings and had cloaked ghosts go in and emp/snipe everything. If the protoss keeps the obs in the back of his army though, you are just fucked. You have to split the map with PF's and bunkers too.

Zelphda · 3 months

Look up Thorzain's TvT build on the Day9 Daily. Against most builds, you can just attack like Thorzain does and win. If you see them doing the same build though, you might want tanks before medivacs. Also, 15 minutes is a very very late banshee. At this point, you want a few turrets lying around anyway.

NoBrainer · 3 months

My opinion:

The mule change makes sense. With this change you can still have the gold bases, which are a cool concept, without racial imbalance.

The ghost change is a little bit much. Now, the ghost base attack does more damage against mutas when the ghost is upgraded.

Until the timer works on real time, the apm tab isn't very accurate. Also, I think most people didn't like the spam filtering because it hurt their ego seeing their apm drop.

Conker534 · 3 months

Watch the Day9 Daily on Thorzain vs Puma. Thorzain does a great 1 rax FE that is very safe. I do it every Tvt. If they try to do that quick 2 tank rush, what you do is you pull a bunch of scvs and stim all your marines into the push while it is unseiged. You MUST have map control to know it's coming or you die. Also, if you scan and see a banshee build, you might not want to fly over your new OC until you deflect the banshee. The only things I do differently from the Thorzain build is getting stim before combat shields (for deflecting that 2 tank rush) and building the CC in my base (for the banshees and hellion pushes)

Athex · 3 months

Late game protoss deathballs are very very difficult to beat. The reason why it is a recent problem is that protoss are finding out ways to keep a low stalker count late game (stalkers are not all that good) so late game deathballs have more splash and zealots. Also, just about all protoss who don't cheese go double forge. Storms are very difficult to deal with because you have to hit every templar with emps and oftentime twice if templar have more than 175 energy. Even if you do end up hitting every templar, HT's turn into archons which are very strong (not sure if you were here when the archon buff hit). Archons also take an additional 3 emps to nullify. And very lategame, you can win a battle and won't be able to follow through because the protoss can max up a zealot archon army in seconds. This is why most terran from the beginner to pro level avoid late macro games. Terran's have an advantage mid game so that's why you see things like 12 minute drops and 2 base timing attacks but if a lot of damage isn't done, terrans usually lose.

I know some people disagree but if you can find some vods of the following situation:

A terran beats a protoss late game without a large econ advantage

Both players are evenly matched

Protoss fills up templar and colo tech and has upgrades

Protoss doesn't make a huge mistake

The game occured in the past month or so

Please post them because me and other terrans need some help.

acaellum · 3 months

You play at the plat level man, you can't use argument by authority. I'm masters terran and can play zerg and toss at the diamond level but rarely play either.

To counter each point: Mech is much more active then it used to be. You have to have hellions moving around all game non-stop. Except on shakuras, you have to move tank lines around all game, picking off expos. Tanks don't move fast of course but you have to be active.

Aggressive early builds are usually all in. Sure you can roach openings and the like but those are more used defensively or for a small amount of pressure. Not very aggressive.

As for protoss being easiest, look at the polls on team liquid and it's the popular opinion that protoss is easiest (except maybe at tippy top korean levels). Also look at the many threads that are about race switching and random players and the popular opinion is that toss is easiest.

acaellum · 3 months

Play some of the campaign to get a hang of the game. Before hopping online, play all 3 races against easy ai just to figure out what buildings are what and what units are what. Also make sure to know which units can hit air.

In general here is how each race works:

Terran: Pretty scrappy race. You need to be active. If you sit around doing nothing all game and attack with a huge army, you lose. Good at harrassing the opponents economy. Probably the largest unit variety. Requires the most amount of micro.

Zerg: They have the fastest units overall. They also have the best map awareness especially latter on. They can't be very aggressive early on without being all in. Known as the most macro heavy race and you will need to get your expansions earlier than your opponent. least unit variety but almost every unit is useful in most matchups.

Protoss: Known for big huge expensive and powerful units. Also known for gimmicky stuff early on. Probably has the most powerful maxed army. Can warp in units anywhere where there are pylons. Easiest to play (though some protoss players would tell you otherwise).

Pick the race you like best not the race you start off best with. The easiest race to play now might not be the best later on. A lot of players start with terran because they are basic to play at first and campaign mode stars terran but later on they have trouble with multitasking. Similarly, some players don't like to play zerg at first because he mechanics are unusual and tough to grasp but, once you get used to it, it isn't that bad.

Join a peepmode game and just observe. In peep mode, a bunch of players join a game, players choose if they want to play and 2 will play each other at random. Watch what they do. They are across all skill levels. Don't put your hat in the ring at first though.

Most important gameplay tip: Always make workers. Don't stop (unless you get like 75 of them).

stargunner · 3 months

I have noticed a very strong change in the meta-game since November from a terran perspective. In TvT, FE's and huge marine pushes are standard and late game pure mech is very popular too. That hellion reaper thing is big too. In TvP, late game toss is unbeatable. We are seeing less all ins from toss and more turtly play. Though robo warp prism rushes are kinda in too. The 111 is dying out but we are seeing 2 base pushes with the 111 composition. In TvZ, less has changed. Though roach openings are pretty big now as hellion play is just about always used.

ABagOfFritos · 3 months

I play a mech heavy style in TvZ but not pure mech. I switched over from pure mech because of it's weaknesses. The biggest weakness is against a very heavy muta style. Now, you may think that thors are good against mutas but if there is no marine backup, they really aren't. You have to magic box and keep attacking different parts of his base though. Late game, Broodlords and ultras are good to have. Broodlords are a better option when there are lots and lots of tanks and ultras are better otherwise. If you make ultras don't be dumb and make like 20 of them and attack move. The reason why a lot of zerg think they are bad is because they think they are broodlords where you just attack with them and win. Use them to tank damage for lings and roaches.

Things NOT to do against mech styles: Make lots of banes. Some zergs seem to just make banes out of habit. Also, making lots of infestors. Infestors used to counter mech hard with the old NP range but now they aren't as important to make in mass. They are still important though for fungaling vikings and spitting IT on tanks.

The very important thing to do though is to counter attack. Mech is slow as shit can can't deal with roach drops and ling counters. Be prepared with a drop force or ling force in position for when they move out.

forgotusername · 3 months

This thread again....

Ok here we go:

TvT: Used all the time. No way to deny that.

TvP: Not used too often because starports need to be firing on all cylinders all game in order to make the amount of medivacs and vikings needed. Even if you do get a raven out, it's really not worth it as toss are getting less and less stalkers these days and that's the only unit that the raven can stop. Much rather spend that gas on upgrades, 2 medivacs, cloak, ghosts, etc.

TvZ: Only used as a mobile detector. Even at that, they are by far the most expensive mobile detector in the game. Yeah PDD can stop mutas which is kinda cool but with enough mutas, PDD only stops a volley or two. I only use it when it's late game and creep spread is out of control. I tried to get them early a lot but bottom line, they aren't worth it.

scamperly · 3 months

That's a large reason why the carrier isn't to useful yes. Protoss players usually go robo tech first because the observer and, since the greatest protoss strength is it's splash damage, colossus often follow. Now, terrans will build vikings and zergs will make corrupters both of which are the basic counter to carriers making the tech switch difficult.

Also the carrier just kinda sucks as a unit anyway.

Chusuf · 4 months

If you really want to do well, definitely try more macro builds. You might not do very well at first but your skill level will increase at a faster rate. I do FE (fast expos) in every match. Here's what I do:

TvT: Reaper Expand. Standard 10 depot 12 rax 13 gas. Then tech lab asap. Make a reaper and you will have about 400 minerals around the time the reaper pops. Don't let the reaper die. Practice microing, multitasking and scouting. It's gonna be tough but it'll help in the long run. Go into 2 more rax, a factory and a starport.

TvZ: Also Reaper expand. I go 2 factory after the reaper pops and pump out hellions but 1 factory and 1 or 2 more rax works too. Hellions into tanks with marine support.

TvP: 1 rax FE or marauder expo. For 1 rax Fe, just make 1 rax and a CC without gas then 2 or 3 more rax. For marauder expo, make 1 marine and 2 marauders. Get conc shell right when tech lab finishes. The CC is made during the second marauder. do some pressure with your 3 attacking units and 1 scv. All TvP games go into marine marauder medivac. Add vikings for colossus and ghosts for other compositions.

G'luck

Zergrusherz · 4 months

After you get used to the game, I really don't see a reason to not customize all your hotkeys. The current standard setup is nonsensical and grid can be uncomfortable at times.

Right now, I have production buildings on 1-4 and I have hotgroups for my units on q-r. A is still attack move and d is my special do everything button (stim, emp, yamato cannon etc.). S is my backup do everything button (snipe, seige, etc.). Space is idle scv. For production, the hotkeys for units are a-g in the order they appear on the grid (a for marine, s for marauder, etc.). I also tried to make it so I can't miss a key with disastrous consequences. Every terran has hit reactor instead of techlab before as the buttons are next to each other so I moved tech lab over one key to z instead of x. My play greatly increased after changing my hotkeys. I would recommend custom keys to anyone.

cma1681 · 4 months

Firstly, pure mech isn't the best idea. Roach drops, late game tech and mass mutas are all very good options against pure mech. I play a heavy mech style (reaper expo into 2 factories) but as the game progresses you just kind need marines, marauders and often ghosts. If you still do mech however, you need turrets and a sensor tower. To tell you the truth, it still won't stop a large drop but acts as a good deterrent. If you think they will call your bluff, you need vikings.

ccm139 · 4 months

A lot of people are not happy with the new apm counting but to tell you the truth, I think it's a good thing. Before, APM didn't actually show how many meaningful actions a player was taking. There were many players that would spam rally point, cycle production buildings and do supply depot pushups while their army was just kinda sitting around. There are so many unused multitasking opportunities available that it is ridiculous. Bottom line, people's egos are bruised when their APM drop and they whine about it on forums and the new APM is better.

Though one thing they need to change is make APM related to real time instead of blizzard time. Hell, just throw out blizzard time and call "faster" "normal" instead.

paro · 4 months

You can open bio and do a lot of damage but it gets weaker the longer the game goes on. If your opponent is going pure mech or has little marines, get air control and carpet bomb tank lines with marauders from medivacs. Works very well.

Another thing you can do, which was my main tvt build until the blue flame nerf, is to open with a 4 blue flame hellion drop and go into hellion-banshee-viking. Look up the iEchoic build, it's kinda like that. It takes a lot of micro though as you have to be moving the hellions around all game non-stop. Transition into BCs late game.

But really, learn how to use tanks. Yeah it's tough but once you get the hang of it, it's really the most important unit in tvt (maybe tvz too). The build I use is this: reaper expand into 3 rax into 2 medivac timing push into marine tank. With this build, you can avoid jumping right into tanks and stop those annoying 2 tank contains.

givegodawedgie · 4 months

Sounds neat. Count me in if you need me. NoBrainer.546 http://www.sc2ranks.com/us/549792/NoBrainer

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