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Official Vote Thread: Induction of /r/CarPorn into the network, and modification of /r/MachinePorn's ruleset. (self.PornOverlords)

submitted ago* by syncreticsrsly guys stop it

The moderators of /r/CarPorn have requested to join the network numerous times in the past few months, and each time I have rebuffed them as I felt that MachinePorn was not big enough to start splitting up content this way. However due in large part to the response in this thread, I have decided to put it up for a vote.

Vote to induct /r/CarPorn into the network and change the rules in /r/MachinePorn to prohibit automobiles.

Vote to forsake /r/CarPorn and leave /r/MachinePorn the way it is.

Vote if you don't care either way but want to show the rest of us that you are active and participating in policy discussion.

Edit: Community Poll Here - please vote.

Edit2: Current Vote Totals:

: 11

: 6a

: 4b

a: jaxspider's vote was counted as no because he voted no on half of the measure

b: Signe's vote was counted as abstain because he abstained from voting on half of the measure

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[–]Wordslinger1919QuotesPorn 22 points23 points ago

[–]kjoneslollololol 5 points6 points ago

y

[–]TheRedditPope 17 points18 points ago

[–]kjoneslollololol 2 points3 points ago

y

[–]TheRedditPope 7 points8 points ago

There were several factors that I took into consideration before voting "yes" on this measure. They are as follows:

  1. The will of the subscribers: This is the main factor I look at or think of every time we have a vote. This time it appeared as if people in machineporn tended to want a different images that were not of cars. They wanted engines and robots and things like that. I looked at the top 10 all time submissions on that site and only 2 of them were cars. Syncretic informed me that in the beginning be submitted pics of cars to that site when he was generating content, but it looked like the users had organically moved away form those types of posts and favored the other content I just mentioned. So that was enough evidence in my mind agree that users wanted less cars.

  2. The viability of of the subreddits in question: Can MachinePorn stand on its own without car pics? Yes. Are photos of cars along going to draw people to CarPorn? Well it has over 3k subscribers so far so--yes. So should these two subreddits exist independently in the network? Yes.

  3. Suitability for the Network as a whole (i.e. does it fill a gap): Well this one is kind of tricky. Ultimately I don't think that question matters in this case. The needs of the users out weigh some arbitrary delineation that we establish. The people want photos of cars and it certainly won't negitively affect the network to add another subreddit, especially one like CarPorn and that has been made clear in my first two points.

  4. The opinions of the other mods: I try to take into account what the mods here think and at least get some of their opinions before I vote on any thread. When I voted there were already several "yes" votes endorsing this measure. Plus the chatter in IRC was overwhelmingly in favor of adding CarPorn. Also, and this is a big point, Syncretic endorsed the idea and made a strong case for it in IRC and in the self post text above. He is out fearless leader and he had good responses to all of my objections in IRC. So when you combine Syncretic's endorsement with all of the other favorable attitudes that the other mods had concerning this idea then it was tough to go against the grain--especially considering the 3 previous points I've made which were already causing me to lean in favor of this measure.

There were other factors as well but they were fleshed out in IRC last night and to be honest I don't remember them now, but the main points have already been stated above so I don't think it matters.

On a unrelated note, I don't think that we should have to defend our votes in the thread. I've had to do it each and every time I've voted. Obviously and abstention is one thing, but a clear "yes" or "no" vote from me means that I have already made up my mind, weighed the options, voted and moved on. If you want to flesh these ideas out or campaign against a vote then there should be a tread for that.

I'll reiterate that last point.

We need to have discussion threads on these votes before the actual voting takes place.

Why that isn't already a proceedure boggles my mind.

[–]syncreticsrsly guys stop it[S] 2 points3 points ago

We need to have discussion threads on these votes before the actual voting takes place.

Why that isn't already a proceedure boggles my mind.

Several months ago that was proposed, and it was voted down. At the time, we didn't have very many mods, communication was very good, and up until then we had been simply discussing the vote as it was ongoing, and it worked fine. Now our mod staff is almost doubled, we talk a lot in irc now (which is great) but not everyone is present (which isn't), and as you can see it's not working the same as it has been in the past.

Every vote thread worked until this one, but apparently kjoneslol and soupyhands are pissed that I didn't consult them first, and kjoneslol thinks it's appropriate to berate me in public for it, so my bad.

If the same measure was presented again I would vote yes.

[–]saldejumssaldejums 12 points13 points ago

At first I thought that machinePorn will suffer, but after some browsing, it may even benefit from it.

[–]syncreticsrsly guys stop it[S] 6 points7 points ago

This was my thought process exactly. The community response was pretty much the nail in the coffin.

[–]kjoneslollololol 1 point2 points ago

The community response was laughable.

[–]syncreticsrsly guys stop it[S] 3 points4 points ago

That's like, your opinion, bro.

[–]kjoneslollololol 0 points1 point ago

Only .2% of subscribers commented and that's not excluding your comments or duplicate commentators. That's a joke.

[–]kjoneslollololol 1 point2 points ago

How will it benefit?

[–]saldejumssaldejums 6 points7 points ago

Machines are machines - mechanical master piece and glossy cars are just not that manly enough to be called machines. That is just a car. So they must be in a car and Machines be manly, pure practical and genious machines.

[–]kjoneslollololol 4 points5 points ago

Did you honestly just say cars aren't manly? What?

[–]syncreticsrsly guys stop it[S] 2 points3 points ago

He must be trolling you brah. Everyone knows that cars are manly.

[–]saldejumssaldejums 5 points6 points ago*

kjones, I believe that you are from some particular western country or perhaps Japan or something, where there is obsession with cars. The glossier the manlier. I have come from North-East Europe, post Soviet child.

Do you know whats common to all Soviet machines? They work only after few kicks with leather boot or hammer rams. I have drive T-100 tractor, MTZ, Vladimirovec, D7 "Stalin" (now seen in museums) and even Soviet harvester. Many people here use cars for practical reasons - cheap, simple, so easy to maintain. Mainly everyone here drives MPVs like Ford and Volkswagen Transporter. For lighter cars people use VW Golfs, some old Audi 80 - 100, Sierras. Real machines. Glossy and rich cars, SUVs are driven by Russian businessmen (BMW and Mercedes), people with small penis, women and western fanboys.

That's why Europe has so many Prius, Golfs and other small, great cars. Men want their tools, that helps them in everyday life, the car, to work and be durable (and not some Mustang or Camaro or Jag) and are not obsessed about them. Even our president has VW Passat, but for representative duties use Mercedes Benz S class. Lithuanian mayor of Vilnius drives bike and seldom APC.

I guess it is our cultural divide. The cultural gap between US and Europe is just a lot larger than one ocean.

[–]kjoneslollololol 2 points3 points ago

You have managed to insult me without actually explaining how cars aren't manly. Well played. Also; I thought you were from Italy?

[–]saldejumssaldejums 2 points3 points ago

I wasn't insulting you. I just say that we have very different culture.

I am from Baltic states. Yeah, I know Soviet shit, played in steel playgrounds on bombers, trains, tanks and I am kind of Soviet Punk.

I am very sorry if I have insulted you. It wasn't meant like that :)

[–]kjoneslollololol 1 point2 points ago

No worries; I wasn't really insulted. Answer me this: is a Ford Mustang manly?

[–]saldejumssaldejums 2 points3 points ago

Old one? Hell yeah!

[–]syncreticsrsly guys stop it[S] 1 point2 points ago

I think he said you have a small penis.

[–]kjoneslollololol 1 point2 points ago

Your mom says otherwise.

[–]greatyellowsharkmediocreblueshark 10 points11 points ago

I think MachinePorn can survive without cars. Having a reddit in the network devoted to cars would be a big draw.

[–]kjoneslollololol 1 point2 points ago

I don't think the question should be can it survive. A lot of subreddits can survive even if we added the most absurd and strictest of rules; take our resolution and source requirements for example. You should be asking your self does the rule make sense. Are cars not machines? Are machines not cars? Are you willing to make that arbitration?

And what exactly is the "big draw" going to be?

[–]greatyellowsharkmediocreblueshark 4 points5 points ago

Of course cars are machines, and cars could just as well stay in MachinePorn with no ill effect. But there are huge numbers of people who like bad-ass, cherry cars, and I think having them all in one place would have a lot of appeal. If, say, tractors or forklifts were eye-candy, on their own, as subsets, for a substantial segment of the population, I think we'd we faced with the same choice. But I imagine the numbers for a car-only subreddit in the Network would make its addition wothwhile.

[–]kjoneslollololol 1 point2 points ago

You're mixing up whether we should add it to the network and whether we should ban cars from MachinePorn.

[–]greatyellowsharkmediocreblueshark 3 points4 points ago

If I'm understanding you correctly - isn't that the precedent set in the Network? A new sub is created from something formerly accepted in the parent sub - then that subject is no longer accepted in the parent - to drive up numbers in the new sub and to better define (or restrict, depending on your point if view) each reddit in its subject matter. If CarPorn is accepted as a good idea, then leaving cars in MachinePorn would only muddy the waters - submitters would be torn between the two and both might suffer. And when I said MachinePorn could survive without cars I meant that it has enough going for it that it would still be appealing and interesting.

[–]kjoneslollololol 1 point2 points ago

No that's not the precedent. That's the precedent with content rules in regards to EarthPorn. EarthPorn has a very strict and concise definition: natural landscapes. MachinePorn is for machines (and originally it was made for cars).

Also CarPorn does not need any help; it's already bigger than a lot of our current subreddits.

If CarPorn is accepted as a good idea, then leaving cars in MachinePorn would only muddy the waters - submitters would be torn between the two and both might suffer.

So we shouldn't allow any climbing in Adrenaline or HumanPorn, no Infrastructure in city, village, or design porn, no fire in DestructionPorn, no military images in MachinePorn or DesignPorn or HistoryPorn, and no plants in EarthPorn?

Specific and concise rules works for EarthPorn because it is so large and it has a specific definition. That is not the case with the other subreddits.

[–]greatyellowsharkmediocreblueshark 2 points3 points ago

What none of this addresses is why it's so important to have cars in MachinePorn. I understand your point of view but I don't think you've told us why you're so passionately attached to it.

[–]soupyhandsVelkyr 2 4 points5 points ago

It is important to have cars in MachinePorn because A) they are machines, and B) people who subscribe to MachinePorn like cars and they upvote pictures of them. Outlawing cars in MachinePorn is basically the same as say fuck you to our subscribers.

[–]greatyellowsharkmediocreblueshark 2 points3 points ago

That seems like an assumption of what the subscribers' reactions would be. I would see it more as giving them more of what they like but in a different place. If you think MachinePorn's numbers would drop in the absence of cars then I agree we should leave them. Otherwise I think we shouldn't underestimate our subscribers' capacity for change.

[–]soupyhandsVelkyr 2 1 point2 points ago

I have been a MachinePorn mod for almost 6 months, I have a pretty good handle on whats going on over there.

[–]kjoneslollololol 1 point2 points ago

Why is important to ban cars from MachinePorn? It's important to allow cars because cars are machines and MachinePorn was created with cars in mind.

[–]syncreticsrsly guys stop it[S] 6 points7 points ago

[–]Reactions 7 points8 points ago*

There's good arguments coming from both sides, and I'm having a hard time deciding. Even though cars are a huge part of MachinePorn, I feel like they would benefit from their own subreddit. This would let the other machine posts shine through. I do however still feel we should allow posts like these: http://i.imgur.com/EJKH5.jpg

[–]kjoneslollololol 4 points5 points ago

y

[–]soupyhandsVelkyr 2 6 points7 points ago*

I don't think we should remove cars from MachinePorn. They are machines too. I think if we are to add CarPorn, Cars should still be allowed in MachinePorn.

[–]syncreticsrsly guys stop it[S] 5 points6 points ago

What do you say to the community reaction in this thread?

[–]soupyhandsVelkyr 2 5 points6 points ago

Since when have we cared what the vocal minority thinks? There are 11,000+ subscribers to machineporn, only 89 upvotes on your thread.

[–]syncreticsrsly guys stop it[S] 2 points3 points ago

http://www.reddit.com/r/TheoryOfReddit/comments/mj0ln/active_moderation_vs_the_laissezfaire_approach_or/

Required reading. xD

[–]soupyhandsVelkyr 2 2 points3 points ago

The point is invalid. How do you know whether the users who responded to that thread actually submit to /r/machineporn? Moreover, you are drawing a line in the sand with the users who do submit images of cars to MachinePorn, saying basically that we do not support their efforts in submitting images of cars to this reddit. The top response in your survey thread asks you to delete and move all the car submissions to carporn! Ridiculous.

[–]syncreticsrsly guys stop it[S] 2 points3 points ago

Moreover, you are drawing a line in the sand with the users who do submit images of cars to MachinePorn, saying basically that we do not support their efforts in submitting images of cars to this reddit.

The same argument could have been said when we added VillagePorn, or BotanicalPorn, or IndustrialPorn, or AbandonedPorn, or VideoPorn... every time we added one of those subreddits, we restricted the rules in a related subreddit to drive traffic there.

This is nothing but a reiteration of the same formula we've used to promote new subreddits for some time now. It works, and I feel that it is definitely appropriate in /r/MachinePorn, where there is most definitely a large percentage of users who are unsatisfied with the prevalence of images that are not focused on machinery and engines, etc, but on the flashy bodywork of cool-looking cars. I think those sorts of images can be easily routed to /r/CarPorn, and anyone who missed them in /r/MachinePorn can subscribe to /r/CarPorn as well.

In this network you don't just judge a subreddit by itself. You judge it by how it works in tandem with other network subreddits, and what benefit it brings to the network as a whole. It's very easy to make a multireddit for /r/MachinePorn+CarPorn, and then you still have essentially what /r/MachinePorn is turning into now on its own.

I believe much of this network's success has been the result of direct moderator action, stepping in and shaping subreddits into exactly what we want them to be, and taking into consideration the health of the entire network.

[–]soupyhandsVelkyr 2 2 points3 points ago

every time we added one of those subreddits, we restricted the rules in a related subreddit to drive traffic there.

off topic, but please explain how this is accomplished with regard to ClimbingPorn?

[–]syncreticsrsly guys stop it[S] 2 points3 points ago

  1. ClimbingPorn is your subreddit, iirc the possibility was suggested before and you turned it down.
  2. Climbing photography is nowhere near as prevalent in AdrenalinePorn as photography of bodywork is in /r/MachinePorn - the need for such a rule is not as great.
  3. We just made a huge change to AdrenalinePorn in regards to the video ban, I would hate to add another new rule so soon. MachinePorn was much less affected by the video ban; static images were still dominant over there before the rule change, unlike AdrenalinePorn.

[–]soupyhandsVelkyr 2 2 points3 points ago

I am advocating no rule change to AdrenalinePorn. I am asking for pics of cars to be allowed to remain in MachinePorn based on my previous arguments.

[–]kjoneslollololol 0 points1 point ago*

The same argument could have been said when we added VillagePorn, or BotanicalPorn, or IndustrialPorn, or AbandonedPorn, or VideoPorn... every time we added one of those subreddits, we restricted the rules in a related subreddit to drive traffic there.

It's not the same argument at all. A village is not the same as a natural landscape. They never were interchangeable. The only reason we allowed the previous is because we had nowhere to put it and even then we were walking a tight rope with it; if there was too much man made 'stuff' in it we would often just remove it. When we created those other subreddits you mentioned we were not changing the definition but honing it. Cars are machines and machines are cars. By removing cars from MachinePorn you are completely changing the definition of MachinePorn and for not a very good reason. CarPorn is doing fine on its own.

I believe much of this network's success has been the result of direct moderator action, stepping in and shaping subreddits into exactly what we want them to be, and taking into consideration the health of the entire network.

Is it how you want it to be or how the users want it to be? I don't want it to be like that, neither do some of us. Most people have voted yes but haven't explained why and we have a few abstains. We haven't even talked about this at all. Your vote is also a complete mess. Why can't we talk about how the rules should change first and then vote to induct it. This is why soupyhands and I wanted to start seeing discussion threads before vote threads.

A lot of people in MachinePorn may complain that there are too many cars but those same people aren't submitting things and cars are still highly upvoted in MachinePorn. You want to get rid of the resolution requirement too? A lot of people complain about that.

[–]syncreticsrsly guys stop it[S] 3 points4 points ago

It's not the same argument at all. A village is not the same as a natural landscape. They never were interchangeable.

That isn't really true. A lot of the shit in VillagePorn are natural landscapes with a village in the shot. They are very closely related, but you're right, it's not technically a natural landscape if it contains a village.

However, images that feature the bodywork of cars and trucks aren't really photos of machinery, either. It's a photograph of the bodywork that contains the machinery. No one is marveling over the gears or the pistons, the photo is "porn" because of the sweet bodywork. I think those images could be moved to /r/CarPorn and /r/MachinePorn would benefit from it.

When we created those other subreddits you mentioned we were not changing the definition but honing it. Cars are machines and machines are cars. By removing cars from MachinePorn you are completely changing the definition of MachinePorn and for not a very good reason.

I disagree there. I think that removing these images is simply honing the subreddit much like we have done in the past. There are still many images that don't focus on the bodywork of automobiles that would be appropriate in MachinePorn. However right now cars are dominating the subreddit and I want to take steps to correct the problem. A lot of people are dissatisfied, and as long as CarPorn is a part of the network, I don't see a problem with moving cars over there.

You want to get rid of the resolution requirement too? A lot of people complain about that.

There is a big difference. We have the resolution requirement because it is beneficial to the network. I don't see how adding a subreddit devoted to cars, and moving pictures where the focus is a car over there would be a bad thing for the network at all.

[–]gehzumteufel 2 points3 points ago

No one is marveling over the gears or the pistons, the photo is "porn" because of the sweet bodywork.

Couldn't you argue then, this subreddit should be renamed mechanical porn? If that's what the aim is, to showcase gears, pistons, or otherwise mechanical machinery, then it shouldn't really be called machine porn.

[–]syncreticsrsly guys stop it[S] 2 points3 points ago

Unfortunately you can't rename subreddits after they have been created, you can only create new ones.

[–][deleted] ago

[deleted]

[–]kjoneslollololol 1 point2 points ago

y and who are you?

[–]soupyhandsVelkyr 2 4 points5 points ago

He's the guy, dood.

[–]Rangourthaman_ 2 points3 points ago

I have made a mistake.

[–]MichaelC2585Literally Hackler 6 points7 points ago

It makes sense, then wanting the engineering beauty, not the artistic body work of a car in their subreddit.

[–]kjoneslollololol 1 point2 points ago

Does it make sense to say a car is not a machine?

[–]MichaelC2585Literally Hackler 8 points9 points ago

Here's an example:

This is what'd you'd be seeing in machineporn, the Bugatti Veyron's transmission, while on CarPorn you'd see it's greatly designed body.

[–]soupyhandsVelkyr 2 1 point2 points ago

So what, should we not put planes and boats on machineporn either? Because you cant see the motor?

[–]MichaelC2585Literally Hackler 2 points3 points ago

Is this about inducting a planeporn or boatporn? Cars possess such a large variety of differences, that it has the ability to be an independent sub, and there is a huge amount of people who appreciate cars, in contrast to the amount of people who admire planes and boats.

[–]soupyhandsVelkyr 2 1 point2 points ago

do you have a citation for any of that? Take a look at the top 100 of MachinePorn and you will see what people are actually interested in.

[–]MichaelC2585Literally Hackler 2 points3 points ago

Well, we'll leave it to the votes to decide I guess. Sorry if I had offended anyone, but I believe carporn would help enhance/specialize the netwok a bit.

[–]soupyhandsVelkyr 2 1 point2 points ago

I'm not offended, but I do oppose the removal of cars from machineporn.

[–]MichaelC2585Literally Hackler 2 points3 points ago

I'm not sure how possible it'd be to have cars allowed in MP, but I don't nescesarily disapprove of it to be honest.

[–]soupyhandsVelkyr 2 1 point2 points ago

It's easy, just let them stay. Change your vote to

[–]MichaelC2585Literally Hackler 6 points7 points ago

Well by the looks of the thread, it seems as if CarPorn's appreciation for the artistic and attractive body's are equal to the admiration to the cars engineering abilities, while machineporn is more focused on the machines engineering itself. Carporn - Bodies, while machineporn is more along the opened hood to see a beautifal engine.

My interpretation of the wants of the subreddits.

[–]kjoneslollololol 0 points1 point ago

Your interpretation is incorrect.

[–]MichaelC2585Literally Hackler 3 points4 points ago

Clarify?

[–]kjoneslollololol 0 points1 point ago

MachinePorn was created with cars in mind. It was originally 100% cars. That's why we ask that you include the year, make, and model.

[–]MichaelC2585Literally Hackler 4 points5 points ago

Well this is my opinion/view on the discussion. There are more things than just cars that MachinePorn can use, and CarPorn won't be to niche since there is such a broad variety of cars.

[–]kjoneslollololol 1 point2 points ago

Okay but that can still be so without banning cars. If people want to see more machines then they should submit more machines and less cars.

[–]MichaelC2585Literally Hackler 2 points3 points ago

I think, say, an engine should be allowed, but not a car's body, body + engine, with focus on the car's looks. As someone previously said, we should guide our subscribers in the right direction, and not muddy the waters at all, and I think with carporn, it allows users to have a place to go when what they want, is cars. Not the occasional car and some other engineering and mechanical creation.

[–]kjoneslollololol 0 points1 point ago

Both should be allowed because both are machinery. Users will still have a place to go when they only want cars, that's CarPorn. Users will still have a place to go when they want to see all machines; that's MachinePorn. It's the same with MilitaryPorn and MachinePorn. Everything in MilitaryPorn can go in MachinePorn but it doesn't and we don't have any rules against it.

[–]syncreticsrsly guys stop it[S] 3 points4 points ago*

Okay but that can still be so without banning cars. If people want to see more machines then they should submit more machines and less cars.

Do you realize that if you replace "cars" with "memes" and "machines" with "good content" you sound like everyone who hates rules and wants to let the votes decide? Pretty much the exact opposite of my style of moderation...

I want to move cars over to /r/CarPorn because they are dominating the subreddit and it's becoming a problem. Yes MachinePorn has always had a lot of cars, but that's because they are popular. However there is a lot more potential in MachinePorn to be more than just a subreddit with cars. If we let the car posts continue to dominate, than users who want to see something more than just cars will look elsewhere, which will mean that there will be more pictures of cars, and less of other things, and the problem will only get worse.

This is a formula that has worked for me many times over, you take a more general subreddit, and you create an offshoot, and when that gets popular enough, you create another offshoot, and so on, as long as the infrastructure will support it. EarthPorn is an offshoot of pics, and VillagePorn is an offshoot of EarthPorn, and InfrastructurePorn is an offshoot of VillagePorn, and if InfrastructurePorn gets large enough we may have BridgePorn, etc...

[–]kjoneslollololol -1 points0 points ago*

That's not what I'm doing though. Stop trying to straw man me bro.

[–]kjoneslollololol -1 points0 points ago

COOL EDIT

[–]HandicapperGeneralRedPowerRanger 3 points4 points ago*

mofos

[–]kjoneslollololol 3 points4 points ago

y

[–]jaxspiderGreenPowerRanger 2 points3 points ago

Dude, Please vote. This is important. MachinePorn's soul is on the line.

[–]syncreticsrsly guys stop it[S] 1 point2 points ago

MachinePorn's soul?

Give me a fucking break, dude.

[–]jaxspiderGreenPowerRanger 2 points3 points ago

Brakes are parts of cars too you know.

[–]syncreticsrsly guys stop it[S] 1 point2 points ago

Sorry I just think you are using hyperbole which is a poor debate tactic.

[–]SaltyChristian 3 points4 points ago

because I don't care either way but want to show you all that I am active and participating in policy discussion.

[–]Antije 6 points7 points ago

!

[–]kjoneslollololol 3 points4 points ago

y

[–]Antije 8 points9 points ago

Machineporn should be more geared to nice mechanical workings (the engine of the car for instance I think should still be allowed) and I think there is far more than enough interest in just looking at sexy pictures of cars to warrant it having it's own separate subreddit (hell my dad has never been on reddit, but made an account just so he could upvote carporn pictures after I showed him the sub.)

[–]syncreticsrsly guys stop it[S] 5 points6 points ago

(the engine of the car for instance I think should still be allowed)

I agree with you there.

[–]kjoneslollololol 0 points1 point ago

and I think there is far more than enough interest in just looking at sexy pictures of cars to warrant it having it's own separate subreddit

You're right and it does.

Why should we ban cars from MachinePorn?

[–]Antije 3 points4 points ago*

I don't nessisarly think they should be banned, cars are beautiful machines. However I think there should be a note in /r/MachinePorns sidebar that tells people there is a subreddit dedicated to cars. You cant tell people cars aren't machines but if there is someone looking to post cars they will most likely be very happy to see there is a subreddit dedicated solely to cars.

EDIT: I just noticed it's my cake day!

[–]kjoneslollololol 0 points1 point ago

Well that's not what you're voting for there, chief.

[–]Antije 3 points4 points ago

Yes but there seems to be quite a bit of rabbling about this so it might be a good compromise. If it came down to it I would fully support them being banned from /r/MachinePorn . It would benifit the /r/carporn community and I think it would benifit /r/MachinePorn because it would allow the subreddit to focus more on different and interesting pieces of machinery.

[–]kjoneslollololol 0 points1 point ago

That's not very fair. You're making a personal decision that cars aren't as interested as other machines. Clearly the users you so champion disagree since that is what they are submitting and upvoting.

[–]Antije 1 point2 points ago

I'm not saying they aren't as interesting as other machines at all. I love cars and have been attending car shows with my family since I was a child. Cars are a big enough subset of machinery that they would thrive in their own community.

The biggest thing here is that when you want to look at cars it's mainly going to be the interesting body work, just look at the carporn reddit, it's sexy car bodywork for the most part.

Carporn is to Machineporn as Climingporn is to Adrenalineporn. Climbing is most certainly an adrenaline filled activity but the community is big enough to thrive as it's own subreddit.

[–]subtextual 4 points5 points ago*

Sure why not.

*Edit: I would rather not vote on this. I am not convinced this has been discussed enough by the people who would care about this change.

[–]kjoneslollololol 0 points1 point ago

There are a few reasons why not.

[–]subtextual 3 points4 points ago

I absolutely agree that there should have been a discussion thread before this vote. I erroneously assumed that the people who would have significant opinions about this (e.g., /r/MachinePorn mods; those of you who mod a ton of SFW Porn subreddits) were generally in agreement about this since it was being put to a vote, and since I don't care one way or another I wanted to support whatever the principle parties involved wanted.

There is clearly a need for serious discussion before this is voted on, so I'd like to retract my vote, and echo others' suggestions for more discussion before a vote on this.

[–]syncreticsrsly guys stop it[S] 2 points3 points ago

I erroneously assumed that the people who would have significant opinions about this (e.g., /r/MachinePorn mods

The problem with that is there really aren't any mods who are exclusively MachinePorn mods. Take a look at the modlist over there:

  • syncretic
  • jaxspider
  • kjoneslol
  • soupyhands
  • TheLegitMidgit
  • rnbws
  • PornOverlord
  • DEADB33F

Myself, jaxspider, TheLegitMidgit, kjoneslol, soupyhands and rnbws are on every subreddit for logistical purposes, mostly to keep an eye on the queues (though kjoneslol handles most of that because he is literally a machine) and for css changes, etc. PornOverlord is a bot, and again, on every subreddit. DEADB33F is a brand new recruit and also mods InfrastructurePorn and DestructionPorn.

We used to have mods that were heavily invested in MachinePorn by itself, but they were removed for inactivity. The mods who are there now mostly oversee the entire network, which is why I opened this issue to the entire network before discussing it with any single MachinePorn mod first.

[–]subtextual 3 points4 points ago

I guess I assumed this was the kind of thing y'all discussed on IRC.

[–]syncreticsrsly guys stop it[S] 2 points3 points ago

We did discuss it in irc, kjoneslol wasn't present.

[–]kjoneslollololol 0 points1 point ago

If everyone wasn't there to discuss it that's a pretty good reason to start a discussion thread .___.

[–]syncreticsrsly guys stop it[S] 2 points3 points ago

Honestly I didn't think you would object like you have.

[–]kjoneslollololol 0 points1 point ago

Another good reason...

[–]syncreticsrsly guys stop it[S] 2 points3 points ago

OK well then start another vote thread that says every vote needs to have a discussion thread first.

Until now we have been using the vote threads to discuss the issue, and that has worked fine. I think it will just create unnecessary bureaucracy.

[–]soupyhandsVelkyr 2 1 point2 points ago

I has a MachinePorn flair, I am a legit machinepornist.

[–]canipaybycheckconcern troll 5 points6 points ago

[–]kjoneslollololol 1 point2 points ago

y

[–]TheLegitMidgit 5 points6 points ago*

Edit:

[–]kjoneslollololol 2 points3 points ago

y

[–]TheLegitMidgit 2 points3 points ago

Because I feel like a lot of people go to Machine porn specifically to look at cars and they can be their own aubreddit.

[–]kjoneslollololol 0 points1 point ago

Why shouldn't cars be allowed in MachinePorn?

[–]TheLegitMidgit 1 point2 points ago*

Actually, I find this to be a good point. I believe that we should add CarPorn, but cars should still be allowed in MachinPorn. CarPorn would simply act as a specific offshoot of MachinePorn. To further explain my stance I will use an analogy of a square and a rectangle. Rectangles represent MachinePorn and Squares represent CarPorn. Although squares are rectangles, rectangles are not necessarily squares. Squares deserve their own subreddit because they are a special rectangle, but we should still allow squares to join in on the rectangle subreddit because squares are still rectangles. With this we can admire all quadrilaterals but still have a specific subreddit to admire the lovely square.

Thus I revise my vote to a under the current framwork.

[–]Signeis literally that one guy... 2 points3 points ago

Although squares are rectangles, rectangles are not necessarily squares

FTFY

[–]TheLegitMidgit 1 point2 points ago

Ahh yes, I will fix.

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points ago

[–]syncreticsrsly guys stop it[S] 3 points4 points ago

I'm going to start calling you "Dr. No"...

...wait, I already do that.

Fucking Ron Paul, man. You are Ron Paul of the SFWPorn Network.

[–]kjoneslollololol 1 point2 points ago

y

[–]frogstomp427The Crypt Keeper 4 points5 points ago

I think r/CarPorn deserves a spot in the network because simply, lots of people like cars. It'll be a nice draw and add another feather in the hat of the network. Tons of people like cars, and frankly I believe they like cars more than they care for "machines." I agree with saldejums, that MachinePorn could even benefit from the change.

[–]Signeis literally that one guy... 2 points3 points ago

for induction
for the rule change

[–]OverlordXenu 3 points4 points ago

, it will make MachinePorn more interesting. More niche.

[–][deleted] ago

[deleted]

[–][deleted] ago

[deleted]

[–]jaxspiderGreenPowerRanger 2 points3 points ago

to induct them.

to change the MachinePorn rule.

[–]syncreticsrsly guys stop it[S] 1 point2 points ago*

Doesn't work that way bro. Yes or no.

Edit: I am counting your vote as because you voted no for a significant condition of the vote.

[–]jaxspiderGreenPowerRanger 2 points3 points ago

Dude, when kjoneslol, TheLegitMidgit, rnbws, soupyhands and I all say we do not like the segregation rule, maybe you should reconsider it.

To be honest, MachinePorn is what made me fall in love with what is now SFWPN. I used to remember seeing every post and screaming the model of the car / plane /train etc etc. Earthporn/spaceporn never did anything for me. And without cars in machineporn its like not having cake on your birthday. What kind of monster would not have cake on their birthday? A diabetic one. Thats who, and we all know diabetics are fun Nazis. But in all seriousness, let cars be posted in machine porn. If your worried about overlap that is inevitable. Look how good of a result the triangle that is Human/History/Military Porn is. They all have overlap and users couldn't be more happier.

[–]syncreticsrsly guys stop it[S] 2 points3 points ago

I would like to talk to you in real time about this issue, some sort of chat or irc.

[–]jaxspiderGreenPowerRanger 1 point2 points ago

Okay... Xhcat wants me to pay 20 bucks to use it. Fuck that shit. Give me an alternative.

[–]syncreticsrsly guys stop it[S] 1 point2 points ago*

xchat is open source nevermind

[–]jaxspiderGreenPowerRanger 1 point2 points ago

Na-uh. Take a look.

[–]JaraxoWhitePowerRanger 2 points3 points ago

Use Y-Chat (also known as X-Chat 2), it's a free version of Xchat.

[–]jaxspiderGreenPowerRanger 2 points3 points ago

Is it better than MIRC? I got that. MIRC is just bearable right now.

[–]JaraxoWhitePowerRanger 2 points3 points ago

Never used mIRC, only ever X-Chat then Y-Chat so can't really comment.

[–]syncreticsrsly guys stop it[S] 1 point2 points ago

My fault. I use mirc. HydraIRC is the open source client I was thinking of, but I don't know how good it is.

[–]kjoneslollololol 4 points5 points ago

how are you going to tell people that cars are not machines?

[–]soupyhandsVelkyr 2 3 points4 points ago

The same way you tell people climbing is not adrenaline; you don't. This is a sub of a sub.

[–]kjoneslollololol 1 point2 points ago

We don't remove climbing submissions from AdrenalinePorn so no it's not like that at all.

EDIT: oh lol you agree with me

[–]soupyhandsVelkyr 2 2 points3 points ago

Yes sir, I generally do

[–]DEADB33F 3 points4 points ago

If /r/carporn didn't already exist I'd say no, but as it does I'm going with .

[–]kjoneslollololol 1 point2 points ago

The only reason you are voting yes is because it exists? You want to add all the other hundreds of SFWPorn subreddits too?

[–]DEADB33F 1 point2 points ago*

I never said that was the only reason.

I don't feel its inclusion will be of detriment to /r/machineporn. Mainly because /r/carporn already has a big enough following to stand on its own, and partly because (personally at least) I'd rather machineporn be more industrial machinery based in the first place.

The second point doesn't really have a lot to do with this particular vote though, which is why I didn't mention it.

[–]kjoneslollololol -1 points0 points ago

So the only reason you voted yes is because you want MachinePorn to be more industrial machinery? Have you ever submitted to MachinePorn?

[–]DEADB33F 2 points3 points ago

Not 'only', partly.

I've been subscribed to machineporn for a long time as it's something I'm interested in, but no, I've never submitted to it.

I've also never submitted to IAMA but still feel it needs less humdrum bullshit submissions from people with nothing interesting to say.
Is that opinion invalid because I'd only be capable of creating a humdrum bullshit IAMA submission?

[–]kjoneslollololol -1 points0 points ago

It is invalid. If you want to see something in a subreddit then post more of that something instead of abusing your moderator powers. The big submitters submit cars to MachinePorn; that's why you see so many of them. You can change that if you'd submit more.

[–]DEADB33F 1 point2 points ago

Fair enough.

[–]syncreticsrsly guys stop it[S] 1 point2 points ago

You want to add all the other hundreds of SFWPorn subreddits too?

Eventually, should they reach a certain level of popularity, and they aren't directly competing with another network subreddit (like WeatherPorn vs SkyPorn), I really don't see why not.

[–]kjoneslollololol -1 points0 points ago

That is not what I was asking.

[–]KingDavid1 1 point2 points ago

I think we should make a /carporn for the car addicts (like myself ) for those who want to look at just cars but not change the rules to machineporn that would exclude them from being submitted. Kind of like when you see a /WTF pic in /funny. There's no harm done because its still funny but people who want to see WTF pics exclusively will visit /wtf. Cars are still machines even if a lot of posts are of cars.

[–]Quattro_power 0 points1 point ago

[3]

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