this post was submitted on
29 points (76% like it)
42 up votes 13 down votes
all 142 comments

[–]longbrass9lbd 88 points89 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

Spray them with your handy vinegar solution, like a cat.

[–]bib4tuna 3 points4 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

And then shake some cheap and abundant baking soda on them.

[–][deleted] ago* 

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

[deleted]

[–]DrJulianBashir 3 points4 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

an abolitionist of the rabid whacko variety

Abolition of what, if I may ask?

[–][deleted] ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

[deleted]

[–]bib4tuna 2 points3 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

Dogs like food, we give them food, dogs like us. We pet dogs/take pics of them. It works.

[–]NoMoreNicksLeft 2 points3 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

recognition of their full rights as sentient, free beings

They're food that moves around. Rights are for people.

[–][deleted] ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

[deleted]

[–]NoMoreNicksLeft -4 points-3 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

ut not so long ago, most people thought dog fighting was good fun.

Bad argument. You've just proven to everyone here that the only reason it's not good fun is because crackpot propagandists managed to condition people otherwise. In other words, there is nothing inherently wrong with it.

Animal cruelty laws only make sense so as to identify potential sociopaths. Where that can be ruled out, I have no problem with it remaining legal.

[–][deleted] ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

[deleted]

[–]NoMoreNicksLeft -3 points-2 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

And as for me, and the people whose thoughts I value, we do believe that in and of itself, dog fighting and all forms of animal exploitation are bad.

Yes, but I'm an atheist. I don't believe in Dog.

[–][deleted] ago* 

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

[deleted]

[–]NoMoreNicksLeft -1 points0 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

Fine. Not only are you a jackass, you have no sense of humor.

[–]ThePantsParty 0 points1 point ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

Would you agree with me if I said they were sex toys that move around?

[–]kaiise 0 points1 point ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

looks like the party....

oh god i canlt finish this.

[–]NoMoreNicksLeft 0 points1 point ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

No more than I would agree that cucumbers are sex toys that grow on a vine.

[–]ThePantsParty 0 points1 point ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

I'm not sure exactly what you meant by that, because your answer could be taken as sarcastic or literal. I suppose it would make sense to not view one food as more of a sex toy than another, so in that sense your response is completely consistent. I guess a better way of phrasing my question would be, would you have any objection to someone who claimed that using an animal as a sex toy is morally equivalent to using a cucumber as a sex toy in the same sense that you seem to view them both equal as food? If you would, what would the argument behind the objection be?

(Just to clarify in case I give the wrong impression, I'm not trolling. This is actually one of my favorite philosophical topics to get people's opinion on, so I don't want you to think I'm being sarcastic or something.)

[–]NoMoreNicksLeft 0 points1 point ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

I guess a better way of phrasing my question would be, would you have any objection to someone who claimed that using an animal as a sex toy is morally equivalent to using a cucumber as a sex toy in the same sense that you seem to view them both equal as food?

I would have little objection to a claim that they were equivalent. Mind you, I might find one more disgusting than another, but this is only a matter of degree and I don't think this is a reasonable way to gauge just which is ethical and which isn't.

As for animals, I'm willing to consider that specific species should be treated as people. But not all of them. Candidates include some or all of the great apes, and perhaps elephants. I used to think that cetaceans (some or all) should qualify as well... but the more I learn, the more they seem like clever animals only.

[–]ThePantsParty 0 points1 point ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

Ok, that's more what I was looking for. Most people that I talk to seem to have very strong positions that it is completely fine to kill and eat an animal, but that it morally reprehensible to use one for sex (usually with some kind of "they can't give consent" argument). You're completely consistent though in that regard, so no objections there. I'm not sure what your moral code is based on of course, but I think the main argument for me is the one regarding suffering. I guess for the most part I am in the school of thought with Peter Singer that suffering is the main thing that we should be concerned about in weighing the morality of something, and in that regard I think the argument applies to all vertebrates since they are all relatively similarly capable of experiencing pain (some even moreso than humans).

I might be inclined to mostly agree with the position that consciousness/personal awareness of self is the main determining factor in the morality of ending something's life (the argument that you seem to be alluding to, although I guess you didn't actually say it). But to me that argument seems to only hold all the weight as long as we are talking about a process where life is ended in some instantly painless way. Going beyond any such ideal scenario however, would seem to require us to look at other factors involved, most importantly the pain inflicted on the animal in the process. For me, the big problem is that it has been well documented that the 3 companies which produce 90% of the meat consumed in the U.S. essentially torture the animals from birth to death (sometimes in some rather unimaginable ways), which would seem to violate any moral sense of 'do no harm' that most people possess. This is why, regardless of the implications of the completely abstract conversation on the morality of life-ending, I think that it's morally reprehensible to eat meat in the current production environment as long as these practices continue.

One of the most telling factors is that meat is just about the only product that people financially support that they cannot bear to watch be produced. Unless someone can actually sit and watch a documentary like Earthlings, I think they are violating their own conscience by supporting the people who perform such actions. Any thoughts?

[–]NoMoreNicksLeft 0 points1 point ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

but I think the main argument for me is the one regarding suffering. I guess for the most part I am in the school of thought with Peter Singer that suffering is the main thing that we should be concerned about

Even if this were true... why the prejudice and favoritism for neurons? You think plants don't suffer?

I mean, unless you plan on starting to photosynthesize yourself, you cause suffering. Avoiding it is impossible.

For me, the big problem is that it has been well documented that the 3 companies which produce 90% of the meat consumed in the U.S. essentially torture the animals from birth to death

I don't like their products. They're unsafe. As it is now, I no longer buy ground meats at all... and I spent this past week trying to find instruction DVDs on slaughter and butchering. (Here's something strange: there are plenty of such, for deer and wild game, but no such thing for hogs, cattle, or chickens.)

Personally though, were I a chicken, I don't think I'd feel better if they euthanized me in one of the Soylent Green pleasure booths than if I were "tortured". Dead is dead.

One of the most telling factors is that meat is just about the only product that people financially support that they cannot bear to watch be produced. Unless someone can actually sit and watch a documentary like Earthlings, I think they are violating their own conscience by supporting the people who perform such actions. Any thoughts?

Haha. I didn't make that up... I really was looking for DVDs that show someone slaughtering and butchering. Not for the gore, just instructional, mind you.

As for your PETA propaganda films, the death of the animals themselves wouldn't phase me, just the thought of how unclean the conditions are.

[–][deleted] ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

[deleted]

[–]shatterly 1 point2 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

Whoa. You're oddly close to being my husband.

[–]MacEWork 1 point2 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

Maybe he is your husband.

DUN DUN DUNNNNN!

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

..and his online alias is crunchy_fetus

[–]wwabc 10 points11 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

what's their situation? are they rich, therefore think saving a few dollars is a waste of time, or poor, and jealous they don't have the same self-control as you?

[–]sealclubber 8 points9 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

This is not someone i can or want to stop seeing.

And what is their relationship to you? How is your frugal lifestyle affecting them?

[–]loranis[S] 11 points12 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

It's my brother.

We used to eat out together a lot, this is one of the things i have cut down on the most, he resents it.

[–]Bibbityboo 19 points20 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

What about cooking meals and eating together that way? He may just regret not spending as much time with you so do it on your terms. Cooking can be pretty cheap and tasty.

[–]ozexpat 6 points7 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

Replace the expensive going-out-to-lunch or dinner by inviting him to your place and do the cooking yourself, frugally, and get even better face-time with him. He might come to appreciate the contact better when he gets more of your time.

[–]kaiise 0 points1 point ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

yes. indeed.ozexpat nails it. what price can you put on love? since you probably got some of your recipes/techniques from your family the food will be full of love- home- style nostalgic comfort food.

however of your brother is concerned for you out of place of love not judgement he will not want you cooking too much but having fun eating out etc and also concerned maybe you have money problems and want to look out for you.

[–][deleted] ago* 

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

[deleted]

[–]VicinSea -1 points0 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

I found 2 restaurants in my area. $25 GC for $10. "Valid for dinner only with a minimum food puchase of $50. 18% gratuity added to full check amount. Dine-in only." So a $50 dinner will cost $44.00 and I have to stay and eat at the restaurant. Not much savings for the hassle.

To top it all off, half the links on the page don't even work, so I would be very concerned about giving them any personal info.

[–]jrfish 1 point2 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

Wait till they have a 90% off sale and then stock up. You'll get the GC for just $1. Some restaurants have just a $35 minimum. It usually comes out to a pretty good deal for a once-in-a-while night out at a nice restaurant.

[–]wwabc 1 point2 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

offer to go to less expensive places, invite him over for dinner (homemade pizza can be pretty cheap, grilling out), picnics, or set a limit that fits your budget (every other week, etc)

[–]spikelike 0 points1 point ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

Do you have access to a grill? Does he? Have him bring the beer, you grill burgers/chicken (saving extras for other meals of course!), and meet up at your home or his or a park. No tipping, no rush, just hanging out being bros, I hope?

[–]RedSpikeyThing 0 points1 point ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

Being frugal doesn't mean doing less. It means doing the same while spending less. If you aren't spending as much time with your brother then you've lost the spirit of frugality.

You either need to deal with the cost of going out, or find an alternative way to spend time with him.

[–]jrfish 0 points1 point ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

What about suggesting cheaper restaurants, or going out for lunch instead of dinner? I find that some cheapo hole-in-the wall restaurants don't really cost much more than cooking at home, and are some great ways to experience new cuisines.

[–]jaybee2 -1 points0 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

Let him pay for it. Problem solved.

[–][deleted] 7 points8 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

"jealous they don't have the same self-control as you?"
That's it, I think some people don't want to see you saving, because they want you to be just like them, buried in debt. Misery loves company.
I have a friend who makes ALOT, at least twice as much as me, but he has child support to pay for 2 kids, has an adjustable rate mortgage he got at the peak of the housing bubble, leases his cars, etc. I'm 10 years younger than him and my income is half, and I bet my net worth is more than his. I was just trying to get some advise from him on some problems I've been having with my truck. His response: "Why don't you just go buy a new one, you cheap fuck!!!" The thing is, I could go buy a new vehicle with cash if I wanted, but I've chosen to drive my existing car into the ground.

[–]dogpenis 9 points10 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

Cook him dinner at your house, just make food better than restaurant grub. Have beer in fridge.

[–]wassailant 9 points10 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

Mantra for life: Have beer in fridge.

[–]kodemage 1 point2 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

Second verse: Yes, you can have some.

[–]wassailant 0 points1 point ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

Beer for everyone!

[–]shinesapper 2 points3 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

Have home-made beer in the fridge. Don't say, "It's because I'm frugal," say, "It's because I want to share something that I made." As Dale Carnegie points out: Put it in terms of what the other person wants.

[–]dogpenis 1 point2 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

"Have home-made beer in the fridge" - Fuck Yeah! Home brew is better than 97% of the swill out there.

[–]kaiise 1 point2 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

home-brewing beer is a art

[–]gclary 20 points21 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

I live in Orange County, so definately run across this. I also work with a bunch of well paid professionals, that tend to want to hit up a restaurant 5 days a week, and do not understand why I would want to be "frugal", since I have a decent job. What they don't understand is I have lots of bills, child support, and I want to save on daily costs, so I can splurge on things like travel. Finally, as part of being frugal, I moved a block from work. Now I just say I am going home for lunch. I also bought a BMW, it's a 2002, so I got it really cheap, but most people don't know how old it is, and they are impressed that I drive a BMW and they can't afford one. If you do frugal right, nobody should notice much other than the eating out part, and that is easy enough to explain by saying you are going vegan, or working out so you need a special diet, or saying you are going home for lunch. I am frugal, but nobdy really knows I am frugal. If it is somebody in your house or a girlfriend, it would be a lot tougher though. I also run a cover story that I make frequent trips to Vegas, so people think I am blowing all my money there rather than paying off bills or saving. Another thing, I am frugal, but I am not a mooch, if you are saving money by mooching, then you deserve any comments they are making because to me there is no lower form of life than a mooch.

[–]tdehnel 28 points29 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

I also run a cover story that I make frequent trips to Vegas, so people think I am blowing all my money there rather than paying off bills or saving.

I don't get this. Isn't it better to say you're paying your bills and saving than to appear a gambling-addicted idiot?

[–]gclary 16 points17 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

You would think that, but I work with a lot of Asians, and they seem to think this is a noble way of spending my cash, like I am cool, but if I tell someone I am trying to pay off bills they think that is dumb. If you live in the Midwest you may get a different response.

[–]againer 4 points5 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

I was pretty shocked to hear that you work with a bunch of asia.s I don't want to seem racist but the majority of Asian people I've met are really frugal themselves and almost pride themselves on frugality.

[–]gclary 5 points6 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

The ones here are too, except when it comes to drinking and gambling. :) Everybody needs a vice.

[–]kaiise 0 points1 point ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

losing money is seen as lucky, counting winnings or losses seen as unlucky.

reminds when i was running a bar's basement security at college for games of Big Two/ PaiGow etc.

[–]asianx13oy 6 points7 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

new school rich asian kids are spoiled; possible they don't know how to be frugal

[–]kaiise 0 points1 point ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

my best friend and producer from HK used to take his Grandfather's chopper to school when he was six.

i actually met his father way before him as his dad was this super smooth player like a middle aged party animal.

i can tell you they don't

[–]metallicirony 2 points3 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

=D Stingy Asian => Me =D

[–]jrfish 0 points1 point ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

I don't know, I find that Asians tend to hide their frugality (I'm Asian and this is what I see from my family). They work hard and save a lot of money, but they use that money to buy nice things - like cars and clothes and houses. If you look at someone like that, you might think that they are really rich, when in reality, they probably just only shop sales, negotiate everything, and coupon like a madperson.

[–]againer 0 points1 point ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

My friend is Vietnamese and that's how her family is. They only obtain the "nice things" after they hve a good amount of money stashed away.

[–]jrfish 0 points1 point ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

One of my earliest memories of my mother teaching me how to save money the Asian way was when we went to the grocery store and I wanted to buy one of those bouncy balls in the 25 cent machines. She told me that that's how Americans spend money - they buy lots of cheap stuff, and they don't have any money for anything nice. I ended up saving the money for an ant farm.

[–]AnnArchist 9 points10 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

it really just depends how idiotic your acquaintances are.

[–][deleted] 12 points13 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

I live in So Cal, I can attest that if he's in Orange County chances are REALLY high they're idiotic (at least in terms of financial intelligence).

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

I also live in Orange County, and I can attest that if you don't live and act ostentatiously, especially in a high paying profession, it's not easy to fit in. I try to be frugal, cook my own food at work (microwave), but I'm in an industry that requires many lunch meetings with clients and brokers - not too easy on the wallet.

[–]asianx13oy 4 points5 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

i thought if you have lunch with clients and stuff...shouldn't those be reimbursed or at least tax deductable

[–]crusoe 0 points1 point ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

Corp should reimburse you. Since the 80s, lunch on your personal dime is rarely deductible anymore.

[–]svdodge 9 points10 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

Agreed. A frugal life you have to lie about is still failing. Honesty (and the potential for weird looks from non-understanding people) is way more mature than hiding frugalness in an attempt to fit in.

[–]sanalin 1 point2 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

I think that how people decide to use their money is their own business. I also think how people decide to be perceived is their own business.

As long as he's happy with himself and his life, it doesn't really matter to anyone whether or not his coworkers know his financial situation.

[–]monkey_zen 1 point2 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

Sometimes flying under the radar is the right thing to do at that time.

->ج

[–]runamok 3 points4 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

I live in Orange County too. Other places you'd be right but not here.

Living beyond your means is a way of life for so many here.

The average house price is around $660k. Extrapolate that out and that tells you household income should be $220k to have that "average" house. It's closer to $72k (as of 2007). Of course many of the lower income people are renters.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orange_County,_California

[–]Qikdraw 1 point2 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

Living beyond your means is a way of life for so many here.

I don't live in the OC, I'm up in the AV, but since I watch Real Housewives of Orange Country I can agree with this.

[–]dr_greenthumb 1 point2 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

I have to lie to be accepted by my peers for being frugal

[–]kaiise 0 points1 point ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

be Out and Proud

[–]philasurfer 2 points3 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

This is actually one of the biggest advantages of a more modest brand of car. No matter what you paid or what the car is worth, I don't like giving the impression that I have money, am loose with my money or anything of the sort.

This is why I drive a hyundai or a toyota. No one, including mechanics, friends, family gets the impression I am in the mood to spend money. Rather, they get the impression I am frugal.

[–]zorno 3 points4 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

Weird, I can't afford a toyota. Even a used one. When I see people in Toyotas I think 'wow they have money'.

[–]philasurfer 1 point2 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

That is true, this works much better with a hyundai. When I go to a mechanic with a hyundai he doesn't even bother trying to rip me off. He knows it aint gonna happen.

[–]gclary 3 points4 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

That also gives the impression you do not want sex from women. >:)

[–]philasurfer 7 points8 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

Haa..that is so 80s. You plan on getting sex from women because of your sweet ride?

[–]corporatehuman 2 points3 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

weird frugal reddit has some odd complexes

[–]gclary -4 points-3 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

No just the attractive ones. The ugly ones I take advantage of their low self esteem.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

Have you ever even touched a boob before?

[–]Hodan 2 points3 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

no he's right it happens all the time in the movies okay

[–]kaiise 0 points1 point ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

hard like a bag of sand

[–]gclary 0 points1 point ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

Are you offering?

[–]oneelectricsheep 1 point2 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

I dunno, I find the Prius damn sexy :P

[–]DOGA 1 point2 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

At least not shallow women.

[–]gclary -1 points0 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

All the hot ones are shallow. At least here in the OC.

[–]DOGA 1 point2 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

I doubt it.

[–]dr_greenthumb 5 points6 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

no it's true, do you live in Orange County? obviously not.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

Not in Orange County; he's right.

[–]corporatehuman 0 points1 point ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

ugh why are you so concerned with people thinking you are frugal or not? first off you have a car and live a block away from your work. you just sound cheap, do you consider yourself a generous person? does your frugality ever let you pay for other people (not being sarcastic - genuinely asking.)

[–]gclary 2 points3 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

In the corporate world it is a little like high school. It is almost a popularity contest when it comes to who gets promoted, who gets the best opportunities, and what kind of bonus\raise you get. If you seem like an oddball or an outsider, you will get stuck in the pidgeonhole of nowhere and always be on the outside. It ios important for me not to seem different than the norm, so I pretend to be a big baller, but secretly I am budgeting to the dime. I am not a mooch or cheapo, when I do go out to lunch, I always make sure I pay every other time, or pay for myself. I am generous when I can afford it, but right now I am in help myself mode. I work in an expensive area, so most people have to commute long distance to work, so they are jealous that I live in such a nice area. They don't do the math and realize I save over 300 a month by walking to work, which makes up the rent difference. I have not bought gas for my car since October. Some people are frugal to be frugal, I more consider myself, efficient. I have expensive tastes beyond my paycheck, so I scrimp where I can, so that I may have a better standard of living. I see a lot of others on here that scrimp on everything, and have a low standard of living, so that they can do as little work as possible. That is not me, I work hard, have a good job, but do not want to be in debt up to my eyeballs keeping up the OC front.

[–]kaiise 0 points1 point ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

Some people are frugal to be frugal, I more consider myself, efficient. I have expensive tastes beyond my paycheck, so I scrimp where I can, so that I may have a better standard of living.

exemplary

[–]oregono 10 points11 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

Snark yourself up.

topic: the ethics of overconsumption

[–]jaybee2 4 points5 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

What are their complaints? Sometimes criticism isn't unfounded.

EDIT: I'm really not trying to start trouble, but some people can take frugality to an annoying extreme.

[–]sanalin 5 points6 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

First, what are your reasons for frugality?

What are this person's reasons for the comments and jokes?

How close are you? If you're married, this might be an issue you'll need to resolve in therapy if you can't get them to understand the importance. If it's just a friend, it might be as simple as telling them to mind their own business until they're a licensed financial planner and willing to donate their services to you.

[–]loranis[S] 5 points6 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

Lots of reasons really, i was tired of the stress of living off credit cards, the financial crisis scared the shit out of me, made me realise how messed up i would be if i lost my job with no savings.

Bottom line is it makes me happy, not something i should have to justify but increasingly something i am having to.

[–]sanalin 1 point2 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

not something i should have to justify

I agree. I was just asking for your specific type of situation to get a sense of why this person might be acting like this. Some people are frugal to the point of being cheap, and they talk about it constantly, and it can grate on others' nerves after a while. Just like when people talk about their diets all the time, actually. I'm guilty of this sometimes myself, and I have to try really hard not to push my views on other people.

That being said, you should demand the same respect. Don't offer any justifications. A polite request to stop should be enough, and if it's not, a more frank discussion about why they're being so hostile could be in order.

[–]asianx13oy 4 points5 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

I am chinese. Chinese people are generally "frugal". But guess what, Chinese people are generally successful too. I've learned something from reddit not too long ago. Its not being "frugal" or "cheap", its being ECONOMICAL. I read this article about how most rich people are rich not because of some brilliant idea that made them a overnight millionaire. It is because they are smart and know not to waste money.

There is nothing wrong with being frugal. I think Americans are brought up without this mindset. As a kid of chinese immigrants, my (mostly white) friends had a lot of toys and video games, of which I had very few. I think given this recent recession, Americans are finally beginning to see the other side. More and more people are conscious of their spending now.

You need to ask this person why they are uncomfortable with your changes. Is it only because they think you are "cheap?" Will he still think that when you have saved enough money to buy that nice car while he is still driving that old POS?

[–]loranis[S] 0 points1 point ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

This is very true, two ways of getting rich, either make more or spend less.

Most rich people get there by spending less.

[–]wilbur-d 9 points10 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

get used to it

[–]robkinyon 9 points10 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

Why do you care what this person thinks? More importantly, why are you even associating with someone who attempts to "take you down a notch"?

[–]loranis[S] 10 points11 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

Because he is family and like every other relationship there are good sides too, my brother has always been there for me my entire life.

I would just like to minimize the conflict.

[–]robkinyon 10 points11 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

Then sit down and talk with him. Maybe say something like "I've noticed that you haven't been very supportive of my recent change to a frugal lifestyle. This hurts me and I'd like to find out what I can do to ease any concerns you might have."

Do not attack or belittle him. Do not try to "convert" him over to frugality. He lives his life and that's it. What you want to do is offer him the opportunity to raise concerns. Who knows, he might actually have valid concerns that he didn't feel able to bring up to you. He might be associating your lifestyle change with being miserly or becoming a Scrooge.

You have to realize that you have done all the research - he hasn't. He is probably laboring under some serious misconceptions about exactly what you're doing and why. But, you can't force this information into his head. You have to provide him with the safe space within which to express what's on his mind. Then, you let him ask the questions, as he inevitably will. Answer very clearly, succinctly, and always frame it as "I chose" or "I prefer". Never claim to have "the One True Way"™ or any crap like that. He is likely to be self-conscious about his lifestyle and you need to make it absolutely clear that this is solely about your lifestyle.

[–]midnightmoonbeam 10 points11 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

Make sure your frugalness isn;t coming off as cheap and annoying. It's hard to tell unless you step back and take an honest look. I had a frugal friend who was quite annoying about it. She would make a big deal about having to spend some money to come out for a dinner with us, even though we only met a few times a year at most. Then she whine about it all night makign the rest of us quilty. What she didnt; understand was that it wasn;t about paying for a meal, it was about coming together adn seeing old friends and having a good time in general. It made the rest of us feel as though our friendship wasn;t worth it. Sometimes she will do embarrassing things like sit at a restaurant and order just a water, or not paying her share of the karaoke room becuase she doens; plan to actually sing through the mic.

I'm sure you aren't doing the same things, but maybe make sure that you arenot doing anythign that might be annoying or embarrassing to someone else. Some people get annoying easily but don't say anything about it, except to make jokes.

[–]ambiversive 0 points1 point ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

People pay money to hear themselves sing?

[–]lawpoop 1 point2 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

He's probably feeling like you've dropped out of his life. He misses you and wants more of you back in his life. He doesn't see it as you saving money; he just sees your relationship going down the tube. Maybe you can talk him into sharing a meal at either of yours houses. Or maybe you can be a little less frugal, go out with him more often, but not as much as in the old dies.

It's the old phrase, on your death bed, you will regret not spending more time with your brother, and you will never remember all the money you saved.

[–]corporatehuman -3 points-2 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

thanks for posting this jesus christ why the fuck does anyone care if someone thinks you are frugal or not just do what you need to do you be happy and if you have to explain how smart you are for being frugal and feel superior

[–]mdoddr 8 points9 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

Here, take some periods ...........

[–]dirtymoney 2 points3 points ago* 

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

I have personally found it to be jealousy. I had a friend that would bust my balls because I was frugal. He would spend money, get into some small debt, and generally try to live the same way his other group of friends lived (in debt and living paycheck to paycheck). He made some bad decisions (bought a house, then took out an equity loan on it to take a vacation, bought a brand new vehicle that he had to default on which destroyed his credit) ...and now he has relegated his life to living in his house and driving a beater etc etc.. ANd I never said a word to him about how his bad decisions have fucked his life.

I have always been conservative with money (but I am ultra-frugal these days). I have always had savings, NEVER lived from paycheck to paycheck. DOnt keep any debt. Have great credit. And live with less. Yeah, I rent a cheap place to live & I drive a beater, but could buy a brand new car if I wanted to (but I dont). Heck, I could probably buy his house outright with cash right now if I wanted to.

Note: I eventually dropped the guy as a friend after getting tired of his shit. He just went too far one day.

[–]Petrarch1603 2 points3 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

I have a very Irish name and I've been called "McJew" for being so frugal.

[–]kaiise 0 points1 point ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

genius. own it.

funny how their culture emphasises fair-dealing and economic frugality even in their holy books.

not sure if anyone lives up to it. but hey. its a compliment then, isn't it?

[–]WalterSear 7 points8 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

It's like veganism: the one's most threatened by the issue are the ones who will give you the most shit.

Or homosexuality, for that matter.

[–]ReddEdIt 2 points3 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

Atheism too.

Leaving the US for political/philosophical beliefs is probably the worst sin I'm guilty of in the eyes of the Americans I know. The people who say "America, love it or leave it" never actually mean it, at least not the second part.

[–]zorno 2 points3 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

Where can you go? Not that my wife would leave, but i'd love to find someplace with people who actually use their brains. I get tired of feeling like a square peg in a round hole.

[–]ReddEdIt 1 point2 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

NZ, 10 years ago. It's not perfect, but the folks are reasonable, friendly, educated and have very much of a live and let live attitude. And they travel like crazy, so they typically have a good perspective on things.

[–]WalterSear 1 point2 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

Bully for you.

I hope you were able to leave for a nice quiet place that won't be affected too much by the coming socioeconomic global shitstorm.

[–]ReddEdIt 0 points1 point ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

The economic tides of the US soar up and down wildly. In New Zealand they just kind of hum along, slightly up and slightly down - nothing too extreme. We're definitely feeling it down here these days (since it is mostly a world-wide phenomenon), but nothing at all like it is in the States.

[–]swskeptic 1 point2 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

I think it might depend on the changes that you made. Care to elaborate? There is a difference between frugal and cheap you know.

[–]loranis[S] 2 points3 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

I budget now, i try to account for every expense and as a result i manage to save about a third of my take home pay.

I make grocery lists and buy things when they are on special for the most part.

I try and buy only things that i need and not the things that i want, i tend to only replace things after they stopped working and not when i simply want the newer model that just came out.

I was pretty horrible with money before, i would just live on credit, never looking at bills and just sending whatever i could every month. I use to consider how much more money i could borrow as how much money i had.

At first it was very hard, i went from denying myself nothing to beeing careful with my money so i can see where i might of talked too much about it but i really don't any more.

I really don't think i am cheap.

[–]boardom 2 points3 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

To be honest, you don't sound frugal. You sound financially competent. I'm not sure why we all seem to assume that someone who understands how money should be treated is 'cheap' or 'frugal'. The majority of people are just financially incompetent..

Sounds like you have your head on your shoulders. You're brother should feel glad to see you have figured it out.

[–]kaiise 0 points1 point ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

its the culture shift,

ever since barclays mailed actual credit cards to people in the 1950s unsolcited

[–]swskeptic 1 point2 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

No, you are not cheap, not in my opinion, that sounds very frugal, congrats!

Anyways, I don't think your doing anything wrong or out of the ordinary. Sounds like this person is just being kind of a dick and very jealous. Well, when the day comes that you have a gazillion dollars saved up for retirement and he is still paying back loans you can laugh right back.

[–]rasteri 1 point2 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

I think we need some more details.

For all we know your idea of frugality could involve showering monthly, moving your family into a cardboard box in the street, or billing your 8 year old son for food and clothing. In which case I think the people in your life might have a point :P

[–]loranis[S] 2 points3 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

I am taking him out to lunch on monday, got his daugther (my neice who i love) a present for her BDay party last weekend when she turned 5 and yesterday i sent a surprise overnight care package of maple croissants to my GF in toronto (she loves them and they are only made 1 month a year).

None of these things are expeptional i know i just mention to illustrate the point that its not like i never spend money, I am not perfect but i really do try to make the people i love happy.

I just can't do it if it means i spend more then i earn.

By my calculations i spent something like 150k over what i made from 98-08.

I refuse to go back to that.

[–]NoMoreNicksLeft 1 point2 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

I think it's perfectly acceptable to avoid a brother until he quits insulting you.

[–]Sharkbutter 1 point2 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

Move to Oregon.

[–]valadil 1 point2 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

I'm not sure how frugal you are, but if you're avoiding eating out you should do it on the basis of food quality rather than price. Why would you buy a pizza that tastes worse than one you can make at home? Your friends probably see your cheapness as a reduction in quality. Turn it around and make the homemade food into the good stuff that just happens to be cheaper.

[–]kaiise 1 point2 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

dependso n you.

i would wear that badge like a political one if i am not a tight wad/petty thief etc

it's time we slowed down and thought about our obsession with consuming even for emotional reasons.

[–]fotopaper 0 points1 point ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

tell them you are jewish, then they'll be like... Oh, ok, that makes sense.

[–]loranis[S] 9 points10 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

He would probably be pretty shocked to hear it...

[–]kaiise 0 points1 point ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

i keep a fake yarmulka, usually to crash barmitzvahs. great spread.

[–]ninjameese 0 points1 point ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

I would just explain that you started out trying to save some money as a cushion in case you want something big or ran into financial troubles but that you came to like the way you are living.

It is a lot less stress and it can be fun to find the bargains.

This may only be about 80% true but could be easier for him to understand

[–]snutr 0 points1 point ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

Once you've explained why you're doing what you're doing and why it's important to you and also told him that you wish he would cease with the comments, there's not much else you can do if he continues with the comments and behavior.

You can't change the way people think and you've done your part in explaining how you feel about it. If he's been there for you your entire life as you say, then he'll realize that he's hurting you and will stop.

If he continues his behavior, then it's up to you to decide how much crap you're willing to put up with. At that point, short of cutting him out of your life you can minimize contact until he gets the hint and stops. Short answer, either live with the comments and have him in your life or don't see him anymore until he agrees to stop.

Remember, there's no such thing as a bad decision. You simply choose the action whose consequences and results you are willing to live with.

[–][deleted] ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

[deleted]

[–]loranis[S] 0 points1 point ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

Well yeah we used to go out to eat like 2-4 times a month, so yeah he is clearly upset that i have toned down the amount of eating out i do.

I suggested we go to a less expensive place (that in my opinion is as good if not better) and he does not want to.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

There is frugal and then there's a cheap asshole.

A frugal person understands that sometimes you must pay more for quality and some of the finer things in life are worth the money, However many great things in life can be free. Its about appreciating everything you have.

a cheap fuck treats everything like its not worth it and all things are created equal regardless of labor costs.

[–]nihil161 0 points1 point ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

I think it has to do with a sort of in-group mentality.

[–]MaxK 0 points1 point ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

Have a talk with them. Make it clear that this is the way you plan to live your life and you're not okay with the criticism. After that, be patient. It takes a while to notice changes in a person's behavior, typically.

[–]dtrav001 0 points1 point ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

You could hand the snark right back to them, a la: "So, you're too cheap to go out to lunch with us ... again?" "Yeah I guess ... and on a similar subject, how's your credit card balances looking these days?"

[–]kaiise 2 points3 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

how to start a losing streak.

[–]dtrav001 0 points1 point ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

Only if you cared...

[–]kaiise 0 points1 point ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

clearly OP does.i was also pointing out most arguments like this are emotive and employing facts just put you on the back leg. you have to address people's emotional needs.

[–]dtrav001 0 points1 point ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

Most of the criticism is passive aggressive stuff ... very small and petty stuff, i tried to take the high road ... but it does not seem to be happening.

Obviously OP's high-road approach isn't working for him ... and I do feel passive-aggressiveness often deserves its own reward.

[–]kaiise 0 points1 point ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

ahh well nothing like honesty to cure that.

very few people you can be sincerely honest with though thats how i measure friends/family.

[–]treebait 0 points1 point ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

I would snark back... but that's just me, not always appropriate for family interactions (I'm assuming this person is family, as cutting ties there is simply not an option).

Perhaps ask them why they feel the need to cut you down over your positive life choice. This is best done privately as no one likes being put on the spot in public. Show them more respect than they have shown you, and that will usually wrong-foot them right off the bat.

[–]jaggederest 0 points1 point ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

Try being less passive aggressive, just confront them about it and have it out. If you can't do that, then take them to a counselor and do it there.

[–]ENRICOs -1 points0 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

It's fucked up when your dominatrix comes to the conclusion that you're a cheap bastard.

[–]loranis[S] 0 points1 point ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

Mistress?

[–]ENRICOs 0 points1 point ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

If that's the agreed upon term...nod, nod ,wink wink.